Get Some

General => General Chat => Topic started by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 19, 2013, 01:01:43 pm

Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 19, 2013, 01:01:43 pm: It's been in the news recently, this group http://www.fairplayonfees.co.nz is going up aginst the bank (first up ANZ) in a law suit regarding the exception fees banks charged (i.e Unexpected overdraft, dishonour fees , usually around $10 to $30)

25,000 people have signed up so far.

I have mixed opinions about it. I agree with the group on the fact, that a $15 fee for an unexpected overdraft for example, if far larger then the cost to the bank.

However, I've been with ANZ all my life (first with ANZ, changed to National Bank, now back to ANZ). And I haven't really had any problems with them. During my student days, where I was continually short of money, I certainly got hit with these fees. AP would be due, but there wasn't enough in my account, I get charged a fee (as well as the inconvenienced of sorting out the unpaid bill). Of course getting a fee always sucks.

However ANZ has also given me an interest free $2000 overdraft because I was a student.

Now that I'm older, and more financially sound, these fees are no longer an issue. I keep a close eye on my accounts to make sure I sufficient funds to pay any bills. I chosen the right combination of accounts which suits my financial situation.

Also, I believe that my money experiences as a student have taught me valuable financial lessons, which I may have never have learnt if the fees were far less (i.e $1 or $2)

Banks are straight up with there fees, and they are avoidable. Plus people can change banks anytime they like.

What do you think? Do you think the fees are reasonable? Or to harsh?
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Craigor on June 19, 2013, 01:07:42 pm: I got charged $20 one night because my eftpos account was like $0.50c overdrawn, and I didn't notice to fix it until the next morning
Considering all the money in my other account right next to it was more than enough to cover the $0.50c debt, I was somewhat frustrated

I think it would help in these kind of situations..
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Retardobot on June 19, 2013, 01:11:11 pm: I hope the banks get some sort of a kick in the mouth.

Don't you ever try to convince me that using a competitor's ATM machine warrants a $5 fee. Or that it is justifiable to charge $5 to setup an AP.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Emrico1 on June 19, 2013, 01:13:02 pm: I think some government regulation of BS bank fees is in order. Needs a review big time.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 19, 2013, 01:17:42 pm: Quote from: Retardobot;1527371
I hope the banks get some sort of a kick in the mouth.

Don't you ever try to convince me that using a competitor's ATM machine warrants a $5 fee. Or that it is justifiable to charge $5 to setup an AP.

What Bank are you with?

ANZ charges $1 when you a non-anz ATM, and setting up an AP using internet banking is free.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Retardobot on June 19, 2013, 01:19:28 pm: BNZ.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 19, 2013, 01:38:27 pm: Quote from: Retardobot;1527374
BNZ.

Had a look at the BNZ site, they charge $1 for a non-bnz ATM, and setting up an AP using internet banking is free.

$5 for setting up an AP in a branch. I think that is fair enough.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: The Demon Lord on June 19, 2013, 01:50:10 pm: I signed up.

In short - once upon a time, it was a manual process for the banks to deal with a dishonoured AP fee or similar and so the fee was there to cover the cost of someone having to deal with it - but since the banking system went online and automated - the fee has remained the same.

The banks would never voluntarily reduce the fees as they are - since they are pure profit - so yes I agree with this type of action if only to get the Banks to re-evaluate the charges and perhaps to force them to use a bit more common sense (ie if you have money in other accounts, allow the AP to go through, with a Overdraft but not charge a fee)
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: PrinceTuiTeka on June 19, 2013, 02:02:37 pm: I think even $1 for another bank ATM is too high. Its only an electronic transaction.

Addressing the point made in OP:

SM strikes me as a reasonably clued up fella, maybe smarter than the average common denominator*. Making assumptions from here, he probably earns at least medium income, but likely more and is at least financially literate enough to understand interest rates and lending. Unfortunately a fair whack of the population lack these attributes and therefore borrow to the hilt, and live week to week. To me this is the banks way of milking people who are financially stupid, and therefore IMO they are preying on the weak to feed the strong.

Its should go. (or be lowered greatly)

*for a monkey
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Lias on June 19, 2013, 04:05:20 pm: I signed up.. I think the total fees i've been charged in the last 6-7 years (whatever the qualifying period is) are likely only $100ish if that, but it's the principal. Like craig said I've been charged large sums for being a few cents or dollars over my limit, despite funds being available in other accounts. That sort of thing just aggravates my testicals..
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Benji77 on June 19, 2013, 04:24:31 pm: I don't like getting charged $2 every time I set up / change a automatic payment.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 19, 2013, 04:31:32 pm: Quote from: Benji77;1527385
I don't like getting charged $2 every time I set up / change a automatic payment.

You must be doing it wrong.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: BerG on June 19, 2013, 04:57:42 pm: I hope those fucker banks get shut down for this shit.

Like SM, I have not been hit with these fees for many years now that I actually have some money. But when I was a student, living on $170 a week or whatever it was, my accounts would get down to less than a dollar every week just by paying for the necessities of life. All it took was for some unexpected fee or payment and BOOM. -$20, which carried on and made the next week even more difficult.

The worst is when you are happily sitting in the positive when THEY CHARGE YOU AN ACCOUNT FEE WHICH TAKES YOU INTO THE NEGATIVE. THEN CHARGE OVERDRAWN ACCOUNT FEE. FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK.

See here: ASB are a bunch of arseholes. (http://www.getsome.co.nz/showthread.php?19042-ASB-Bank-are-a-bunch-of-arseholes.)
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Emrico1 on June 19, 2013, 05:43:33 pm: Yeah, that shit is criminal.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pyromanik on June 19, 2013, 06:06:00 pm: Quote from: PrinceTuiTeka;1527377
I think even $1 for another bank ATM is too high. Its only an electronic transaction.

Nah, it's to do with the charges incurred by accessing another bank's records, etc, or some bullshit like that. There is an actual cost to your bank, or something.

However $5 monthly for my account to sit there is a bit bullshit. "Maintenance fees". Fuckoff, you ain't maintaining shit.

I was with National once. I told my account manager to remove all OD facilities on my account, including giving a DENIED instead of an automatic OD that'd be charged at $50million per day.
4 months later I get a call from National head office asking when I'm going to pay back the $6billion debt I'd acrewed in the last week after I'd accidentally overdrawn my account 2 weeks beforehand. The told me I'd better make a payment plan or they'd pass me to baycorp. I told them $10 a week was all I could afford, because I was a student. They said it wasn't good enough. So I paid $20 a week until I acrewed $20billion (as of course it kept incurring OD fees) in another bank, at which point I strode into National and told them that here's the money to break even and close my account because you're a pack of lying swindlers. At which point they told me they required at least another one million dollars because that's what it cost to close an account. Luckily I had that in my wallet, scratching the last of it together with coins. I walked out very fucked off but relieved that I could now slander a shit bank all over the internet.

Then when I expliained my unfortunate situation to another bank rep when testing out another bank she belittled me and told me that I was a grown up and I should be able to take care of my own account. So I did. I paid off the extra 5c it took to close my account and never came back. Fuck you BNZ. You're good and shit at the same time. I just don't get it.

Westpac on the other hand, never been anything but champions to me. I don't have any fees because I've got an electronic account. So long as I don't step foot into a branch they pretty much never charge me, save a few bob here and there for AP ammendments ($2 which I don't really have issue with because I shouldn't change it), and maybe a very reasonable ANNUAL maintenance fee.

ANZ on the other hand charge me $5 a month my account that I only make deposits into since a machine ate my card and they didn't send me a new one. Worse yet they don't have an electronic account equivalent. And they're always about 10 years behind when it comes to internet banking. Last time I tried to change my account type they told me I had to CLOSE my account and then open a new one. Half a year later they magically managed to do it without telling me becaues they 'grandfathered' my old account type that bascially only charged me maintenance fees for ACTUALLY USING THE ACCOUNT. That was far more reasonable, except the fees were still a bit steep. This year they finally told me it was possible to get no fees on my account, but only if I paid my wages from my main job (if I had more than one) into it. How would they know if it's my MAIN job? Better yet, WHY should they? Wankers.

Everyone has shit stories about one bank or the other. I find they're pretty much all the same. Except maybe TSB. They gave my uncle a large sum of cash once just for being a customer. That sounds like a good bank.

The one I don't get is AP failure penalty.
You try to use your money to pay your debts, and when your account doesn't have enough of your money, the bank takes some instead.
I'm all WHAAAAAAT? shouldn't it be my debtor's responsibility to charge me extra, if they so choose? Why the fuck should the bank care? It's not like it's not an electronic transaction these days or something. It's not like my debtor is going to come around and bust in my banker's knee caps for not showing up on time with the money or anything... I can't think of any reason a bank would be all "Oh, you're out of money? Now you're out $25 more!". They're not my parents, they shouldn't be penalising to teach me a lesson on money management or anything...
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: swindle on June 19, 2013, 06:43:09 pm: So many people out there can't get jobs. Even more live week to week, pay to pay. We continuously hear of the recession, how there is no money and how we should tighten belts.

Banks post 500 million dollar profits throughout.

As far as I am concerned, anyone who works for a bank, that doesn't work in a brach doing the shit work, can fucking die a horrible cancer ridden death. I hope its painful, and slow, and costly. I hope they burn in their own homes, drown in the smoke and sizzle like bacon. I hope they lose everything they hold dear and cut their own necks. I fucking hope those miserable cunts fucking die.

Every.

Single.

One.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pyromanik on June 19, 2013, 06:45:48 pm: That's a bit harsh.

I think of banks as an autonomous machine. So many folks working hard, concentrating on their own little section, the larger picture pretty much just perpeuates itself because no one can change it, they're just too massive and self fufilling.
Unless maybe you're talking about the REAL high ups.
But it's still harsh.

I live week to week as you describe. I earn moderately well, but have debts and taxes and a nice flat to rent. I break just over even, but when I want to have a little fun or treat the missus to a dinner, then that little extra is gone and I'm down to almost coins until the next pay day. That's just the reality of it really. Less bank fees aren't going to save me, I just need to deal with it. Get a raise, better job, less debts, whatever. It's my position to improve, not the banks.

However if I were to get another job for more pay, I'd likely be moving cities, which would probably push living costs up again, either by rent to be close to the job or by travel costs. In the end it's all just swings and roundabouts.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: BerG on June 19, 2013, 06:46:15 pm: When are we having post of the year awards?

Cancel it, Swindle just won.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: swindle on June 19, 2013, 06:46:41 pm: Quote from: PrinceTuiTeka;1527377
and therefore IMO they are preying on the weak to feed the ~~strong~~ greedy

FTFY brother.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: swindle on June 19, 2013, 06:48:10 pm: Quote from: Pyromanik;1527407
But it's still harsh.

Harsh?

Not even close.

I'm going nice.

Ain't even breaking out the rape scenarios yet.

I'll get my moneys worth, you cunts.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pyromanik on June 19, 2013, 06:52:38 pm: Matress time for you bro.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: swindle on June 19, 2013, 06:57:39 pm: If only we lived in a world where one could suffice without having to join a bank.

Sadly I feel we do not.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Speakman on June 19, 2013, 08:17:19 pm: Quote from: swindle;1527406
So many people out there can't get jobs. Even more live week to week, pay to pay. We continuously hear of the recession, how there is no money and how we should tighten belts.

Banks post 500 million dollar profits throughout.

As far as I am concerned, anyone who works for a bank, that doesn't work in a brach doing the shit work, can fucking die a horrible cancer ridden death. I hope its painful, and slow, and costly. I hope they burn in their own homes, drown in the smoke and sizzle like bacon. I hope they lose everything they hold dear and cut their own necks. I fucking hope those miserable cunts fucking die.

Every.

Single.

One.

You cannot give Reputation to the same post twice.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: toofast on June 19, 2013, 08:17:42 pm: I do agree with the case in a certain extent because some of those fees seem a bit unreasonable to the cost to the bank.

I do find kiwibank good however, in terms of not many fees. But i do have a graduate bank pack combined with a zero fees mastercard, so that helps. But I did once went over my credit limit on my credit card, and they just put a little message on my internet banking page, saying that i had gone over the limit but they had covered it and to try get it back within the limit. Which i thought was good, because i was expecting some sort of penalty fee.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Tandoori on June 19, 2013, 09:09:24 pm: Do
you
know
what
I
hate
more
than
those
fucking
greedy
banks
?
That
Fucking
Greedy
Banks
(http://static2.stuff.co.nz/1321147754/007/5958007.jpg)
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pyromanik on June 19, 2013, 10:34:55 pm: ^ I'd rep that, but I already gave you some.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Zarkov on June 19, 2013, 10:48:26 pm: Been in Aus for a month, and bled white every day by Aus/NZ banks.

ANZ in NZ can't begin to explain why ANZ in Aus is ripping me off on every credit [which is the only convenient option] transaction.

It's deliberately turning a blind eye to the inherent dishonesty involved imo.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Equity on June 19, 2013, 10:54:59 pm: I got a platinum credit card today :) And I pay no fees at all so I cant complain. The ANZ make your own eftpos card is also mean...and free!
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pyromanik on June 19, 2013, 11:09:35 pm: Quote from: Zarkov;1527442
Been in Aus for a month, and bled white every day by Aus/NZ banks.

ANZ in NZ can't begin to explain why ANZ in Aus is ripping me off on every credit [which is the only convenient option] transaction.

It's deliberately turning a blind eye to the inherent dishonesty involved imo.

ANZ NZ and ANZ AU are two separate entities. The systems are incompatible. They only share a common owner.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Lias on June 20, 2013, 12:01:09 am: Quote from: Pyromanik;1527446
ANZ NZ and ANZ AU are two separate entities. The systems are incompatible. They only share a common owner.

Don't know shit about banking, so talk slowly. Why the fuck cant a bank that operates in two countries, give you a bank account that works in both countries. It'd be like Vodafone saying "Nah fuck off, no roaming in aussie"
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Virus. on June 20, 2013, 12:37:14 am: Student here. Course related costs are keeping my head pretty firmly above water, but if someone in the flat misses a payment and the AP can't go through, boom $15 fee.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 20, 2013, 08:43:20 am: Quote from: Lias;1527448
Don't know shit about banking, so talk slowly. Why the fuck cant a bank that operates in two countries, give you a bank account that works in both countries. It'd be like Vodafone saying "Nah fuck off, no roaming in aussie"

It is like Vodafone. Being a NZ Vodafone customer doesn't get you any better deals in Aus even though Vodafone operates over there as well. Still get charged outrageous roaming rates regardless.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 20, 2013, 08:47:44 am: Quote from: Tandoori;1527429
Do
you
know
what
I
hate
more
than
those
fucking
greedy
banks
?
That
Fucking
Greedy
Banks
([url]http://static2.stuff.co.nz/1321147754/007/5958007.jpg[/url])

While I was clicking I was thinking, this better be worth it.

And it was.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: BerG on June 20, 2013, 09:24:21 am: I was hoping for some special porn or something.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pitchey on June 20, 2013, 01:18:27 pm: How does a bank pay for their staff's wages, bank properties, the hardware/software for controlling money/investments, electricity to said bank, the paper forms they use etc. etc.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: The Demon Lord on June 20, 2013, 01:34:18 pm: Quote from: Pitchey;1527485
How does a bank pay for their staff's wages, bank properties, the hardware/software for controlling money/investments, electricity to said bank, the paper forms they use etc. etc.

By charging a higher interest rate on money the lend out compared to the interest they pay on savings that are held with them

Economics 101 brah
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Craigor on June 20, 2013, 01:37:00 pm: Quote from: Pitchey;1527485
How does a bank pay for their staff's wages, bank properties, the hardware/software for controlling money/investments, electricity to said bank, the paper forms they use etc. etc.
Interest.. *looks at mortgage history*.. yup.. Interest..
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pyromanik on June 20, 2013, 05:48:51 pm: Quote from: Lias;1527448
Don't know shit about banking, so talk slowly. Why the fuck cant a bank that operates in two countries, give you a bank account that works in both countries. It'd be like Vodafone saying "Nah fuck off, no roaming in aussie"

Reserve bank.
Different currencies.
Different laws.

Also like vodafone.
NZ number, NZ customer, NZ dollars. Connection to external network = roaming, even if it is the same company name.
Once upon a time it used to be roaming if you weren't in the same city as you registered the phone, so just be happy mmkay.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: deanox on June 20, 2013, 06:04:54 pm: Quote from: Craigorsarus;1527489
Interest.. *looks at mortgage history*.. yup.. Interest..

Very interesting.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Tandoori on June 20, 2013, 06:05:12 pm: Why isn't the Big Mac I buy in New Zealand made of American Beef!
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pyromanik on June 20, 2013, 06:51:56 pm: Quote from: Zarkov;1527442
Been in Aus for a month, and bled white every day by Aus/NZ banks.

ANZ in NZ can't begin to explain why ANZ in Aus is ripping me off on every credit [which is the only convenient option] transaction.

It's deliberately turning a blind eye to the inherent dishonesty involved imo.
Quote from: Pyromanik;1527446
ANZ NZ and ANZ AU are two separate entities. The systems are incompatible. They only share a common owner.

Not to mention the card is in NZD, the foreign currency exchange tax is one reason.
Credit card companies charge for every transaction as it is, so you wear that cost + currency conversion.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Zarkov on June 20, 2013, 07:29:22 pm: Quote from: Pitchey;1527485
How does a bank pay for their staff's wages, bank properties, the hardware/software for controlling money/investments, electricity to said bank, the paper forms they use etc. etc.

No argument with that.

But they're not passing on the benefits of the computer age.

They're still charging as though some guy was manually making every transaction, instead of a big data centre doing a million things a second.

Why else charge for stuff charged to my credit card here in Aus, as though there were actual paper and signatures involved?
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pyromanik on June 20, 2013, 11:52:09 pm: Umm...
Because of all the fees and costs to them involved.

I think you forget that VISA or MasterCard own and run your credit card. Your bank just facilitates it.

AND IT'S IN ANOTHER CURRENCY.

Also, who pays for the data centre? Who pays for it's maintenance? Who pays when something collapses and needs replacing?
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: BerG on June 21, 2013, 06:20:54 am: The Prime Minister? He is responsible for everything.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 21, 2013, 08:43:34 am: I thought the Queen of England was responsible for everything.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 21, 2013, 08:49:15 am: Quote from: Zarkov;1527521
No argument with that.

But they're not passing on the benefits of the computer age.

They're still charging as though some guy was manually making every transaction, instead of a big data centre doing a million things a second.

I'd say they are. All the banks have electronic accounts which have no fees for things like setting up AP, provided they are set up online.

All the manual transaction fees are for when it's manually done in a branch by some guy.

Unarranged overdraft fee can be pretty silly, because usually the only way to get into an unarranged overdraft is by another fee. It's pretty much a double fee.

That, and the fee for a failed AP payment. They should just decline it like how an eftpos transaction gets declined. Or pay it and put the account into overdraft, I wouldn't mind the overdraft fee so much in that case, because at least the bill go paid.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 21, 2013, 08:59:44 am: Quote from: Equity;1527443
I got a platinum credit card today :) And I pay no fees at all so I cant complain. The ANZ make your own eftpos card is also mean...and free!

Do you use your platinum card to book your private jet?
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: The Demon Lord on June 21, 2013, 09:35:06 am: Quote from: Spacemonkey;1527562
I'd say they are. All the banks have electronic accounts which have no fees for things like setting up AP, provided they are set up online.

All the manual transaction fees are for when it's manually done in a branch by some guy.

Unarranged overdraft fee can be pretty silly, because usually the only way to get into an unarranged overdraft is by another fee. It's pretty much a double fee.

That, and the fee for a failed AP payment. They should just decline it and how an eftpos transaction gets declined. Or pay it and put the account into overdraft, I wouldn't mind the overdraft fee so much in that case, because at least the bill go paid.

I too found that rather cheeky:

"well your $15 AP couldn't go through because of insufficient funds and your account can't go into Overdraft, so we added a $20 fee and because this put your account into Overdraft - we have charged you an unarranged Overdraft fee of $20"

This did happen to me once - I spewed at ASB (only time I have done so) and my Dad (I was 15 at the time) also spewed at them and threatened to move his business banking from ASB. Suffice to say they relented and agreed that if my account can't go into OD for a $15 AP, then it shouldn't be able to go into OD for a $20 fee and credits were processed.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: BerG on June 21, 2013, 09:39:50 am: Quote from: Spacemonkey;1527561
I thought the Queen of England was responsible for everything.

The Queen gets the money from the bank who gets it from the Prime Minister.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Scunner on June 21, 2013, 12:31:28 pm: In England, first the Queen gets the money, then she gets the power, then she gets the women.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: BerG on June 21, 2013, 01:57:26 pm: The kids who are sick cant do hip-hop any more. Their tummies, their tummies are so very sore.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Apostrophe Spacemonkey on June 21, 2013, 02:18:30 pm: We need to build a trap so we can catch all the robbers.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Pyromanik on June 21, 2013, 08:43:58 pm: I just don't whateven just happen
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Tandoori on June 22, 2013, 06:10:02 am: Quote from: Pyromanik;1527625
I just don't whateven just happen

Just feel inside and stuff like that. It will become clearererer.
Title: Bank Fees
Post by: Codex on June 30, 2013, 11:03:54 am: there were a bunch of fees for removing money from an account I got charged, without being told at all that the account would do this, disputed with the bank and they refunded o-o

When I was with ANZ, they used to charge 30 a month for some savings account I had then would refund it again later because I was a minor, the last time they did this it went into negatives, they then charged nearly $100 in overdraught fees and then proceeded to charge further on what was charged. I withdrew whatever was left and went to another bank. ANZ can go suck a bag of dicks