Religion. The evolution, creation and everything in between megathread

[Ngati_Grim]

Being taught that murder, rape, discrimination and other evil acts is wrong, is a bad thing? No-one is forced to go to church, people choose to.

Children are 'forced' to go to church you prig.
As Richard Dawkins says: "There are no religious children, only children of religious parents"


Reincarnation?

Heck no!

The closest I can get to that is that when we die our bodies break down and our atoms are dispersed and absorbed.
But reincarnation in the 'traditional' Hindu sense. Nope.

[psyche]

Then blame the parents. Why are you blaming religion?

[Ngati_Grim]

Religion. The evolution, creation and everything in between megathread

[Retardobot]

Then blame the parents. Why are you blaming religion?

Because it is religion that is fueling the parents decision to take them to church.

[psyche]

Because it is religion that is fueling the parents decision to take them to church.

Look, you can't blame the entire fucking concept of religion for some stupid parents that are not able to make good decisions with their kids. If they force their children to go to church, it's entirely the responsibility of the parents, no-one else.

I've already agreed with you that I don't think church is a necessary thing, what the hell else do you want? Some parents force their kids to eat fatty take-away foods, should we start pissing and moaning about McDonald's and Burger King aswell?

Heck no!

The closest I can get to that is that when we die our bodies break down and our atoms are dispersed and absorbed.
But reincarnation in the 'traditional' Hindu sense. Nope.

But would it not make sense that if atoms disperse they may eventually form into a new consciousness? Almost sounds scientificially plausible to me. If we recognize that we all came from the same place, and are essentially connected to each and every thing in the universe in some ways, and that the very elements that formed life came from the dust of stars - I don't think the idea of reincarnation is so implausible. Nature seems to be an endless cycle, we are a part of nature so I don't see why we would be an exception to this.

I agree with Arnifix that buddhism is a cool religion, they definately have some interesting ideas even if they don't address the issue of the origin of life/the universe.

[psyche]

Because it is religion that is fueling the parents decision to take them to church.

Look, you can't blame the entire fucking concept of religion for some stupid parents that are not able to make good decisions with their kids. If they force their children to go to church, it's entirely the responsibility of the parents, no-one else.

I've already agreed with you that I don't think church is a necessary thing, what the hell else do you want? Some parents force their kids to eat fatty take-away foods, should we start pissing and moaning about McDonald's and Burger King aswell?

Heck no!

The closest I can get to that is that when we die our bodies break down and our atoms are dispersed and absorbed.
But reincarnation in the 'traditional' Hindu sense. Nope.

But would it not make sense that if atoms disperse they may eventually form into a new consciousness? Almost sounds scientificially plausible to me. If we recognize that we all came from the same place, and are essentially connected to each and every thing in the universe in some ways, and that the very elements that formed life came from the dust of stars - I don't think the idea of reincarnation is so implausible. Nature seems to be an endless cycle, we are a part of nature so I don't see why we would be an exception to this.

I agree with Arnifix that buddhism is a cool religion, they definately have some interesting ideas even if they don't address the issue of the origin of life/the universe.

[Retardobot]

Look, you can't blame the entire fucking concept of religion for some stupid parents that are not able to make good decisions with their kids.

Yes i can.

I blame the entire concept of money for most of the troubles man kind has today (an example). Why can't i blame religion for bad parenting?

Some parents force their kids to eat fatty take-away foods, should we start pissing and moaning about McDonald's and Burger King aswell?

We do though, constantly. We are always complaining about fast-food.

[psyche]

Why can't i blame religion for bad parenting?

Because that would be retarded? Just a thought.

[Ngati_Grim]

Some parents force their kids to eat fatty take-away foods, should we start pissing and moaning about McDonald's and Burger King aswell?

I do....don't forget starbucks and kfc :asian:

But would it not make sense that if atoms disperse they may eventually form into a new consciousness?

Well, I'm sure that some of my atoms may well find their way into some sort of consciousness (plant/animal) , most probably through the food chain, but for them to re-aggregate into one complete organism doesn't sound very plausible to me

I agree with Arnifix that buddhism is a cool religion, they definately have some interesting ideas even if they don't address the issue of the origin of life/the universe.

Buddhism isn't a religion per se....it is more akin to a philosophy.

It's a nice idea in theory, but in practice, it really is unworkable, especially in a post-postmodern (soft-modern) Western society.

[psyche]

Well, I'm sure that some of my atoms may well find their way into some sort of consciousness (plant/animal) , most probably through the food chain, but for them to re-aggregate into one complete organism doesn't sound very plausible to me

Plants don't have a consciousness. They have life, but not consciousness. Animals, but not humans? I thought you considered us animals anyway.

Buddhism isn't a religion per se....it is more akin to a philosophy.

It's a religion aswell as a philosophy. They practice certain rituals aswell, which could classify it as a religion.

[Retardobot]

Because that would be retarded? Just a thought.

I've seen it happen first hand.

Also, did you watch a 60 minute story about a small child, i don't think this child was even 1year old. It's (i call the baby "it" because i am unsure of the sex) parent's were heavily influenced by their religion. The child had Meningococcal Disease and was on the verge of death but had the chance to survive if it was treated at a local hospital.

The parents ended up taking the baby into the hospital but opted to decline and modern treatments and relied upon the "power of jesus" to heal their baby. With no real signs of improved health from the almighty the parents then said that if God wanted the baby to be treated in the hospital then the security guard would close the door on them and not let them leave the premises upon taking their child home.

The parents got out into the parking lot with their child when the security guard called the parents and said "excuse me, should you be taking your sick child home?". They ignored him and the baby didn't survive more than 2 days.

Pretty devastating form of "Parenting controlled by religion" if you ask me. Extreme case, i know, but it's easy to blame religion for bad parenting.

[Ngati_Grim]

Plants don't have a consciousness. They have life, but not consciousness. Animals, but not humans? I thought you considered us animals anyway.

We are animals. That's why I thought I didn't need to make any distinction.
You haven't read "The Secret Life of Plants" then?  :asian:

[psyche]

Yes, that's sad. But again that isn't 'religion's fault' - it's the result of the parents being fucking idiots.

People do dumb things. I could easily bring up numerous examples of parents who aren't religious and have caused the death of their child due to negligence.

Why am I even arguing about this? This is the stupidest argument I have ever engaged in.

[Retardobot]

Yes, that's sad. But again that isn't 'religion's fault' - it's the result of the parents being fucking idiots.

WHAT!?

Religion is the vehicle which drives them to make choices.

Yes, it relies on the people being impressionable (when you think about it, humans are VERY impressionable) but it's religion that is forcing them to make the wrong decisions.

[psyche]

We are animals. That's why I thought I didn't need to make any distinction.
You haven't read "The Secret Life of Plants" then?  :asian:

So you believe that after your death, and your body has decomposed, you will probably become a plant? Doesn't sound like much fun.

I don't understand exactly what you are trying to say.

I haven't read that no, but I already know that plants have a beautiful and interesting lifespan. All of nature does. I don't need a book to tell me that.

[Arnifix]

WHAT!?

Religion is the vehicle which drives them to make choices.

Yes, it relies on the people being impressionable (when you think about it, humans are VERY impressionable) but it's religion that is forcing them to make the wrong decisions.

Don't worry about it, he obviously hasn't thought about it very hard. By his logic, Nazi ideals are just fine.

Also, the example you used isn't uncommon. That's the fourth or fifth story I've heard about things similar to that, no blood transfusions etc.

[psyche]

WHAT!?

Religion is the vehicle which drives them to make choices.

Yes, it relies on the people being impressionable (when you think about it, humans are VERY impressionable) but it's religion that is forcing them to make the wrong decisions.

Eh, whatever, your argument is going absolutely nowhere. You realise by saying it is the fault of religion for bad parenting, you are blaming every single cultural religion in the world for the failings of a few people? Do you have any idea how ridiculous that is?

Do you know how many parents that do retarded things that aren't religious? Do you not see my point? Are you really so dense?

[Ngati_Grim]

So you believe that after your death, and your body has decomposed, you will probably become a plant? Doesn't sound like much fun.

FFS, it's not about 'fun'.

And I didn't say I would probably become a plant. What I meant (and I realise I am going to have to be explicit for you to understand...or would you like it in pictures, or maybe a tag book?) was that when I die, post-decomposition (and during, given the sheers numbers of decomposers around) or cremation, my atoms will be dispersed...some will be taken up by plants, some by animals - including that strange beast Homo sapiens sapiens- and some will be locked up in inorganic objects like rocks (though some rocks are organic in origin, so there's another possibility). Some may even go into space.

But to die and then be reborn as a complete organism , nah...don't buy it.\

Ad hominem: you should change the 'e' in your name to 'o' 'cause you're fucking nuts!

[psyche]

Ad hominem: you should change the 'e' in your name to 'o' 'cause you're fucking nuts!

Says the guy that thinks the entire universe and all existence is a sublimely random accident. Idiot.

FFS, it's not about 'fun'.

Oh yeah, life shouldn't be fun, it's all about 'perpetuating the species'. Fuck, you are made of 100% fail.

[Ngati_Grim]

ok then...please...give me YOUR concept/understanding of 'god' and your take on the entire universe and all existence   :sly:

[psyche]

ok then...please...give me YOUR concept/understanding of 'god' and your take on the entire universe and all existence   :sly:

I can only give you my personal beliefs based on my understanding of various things. In the end, that's all it is, a personal belief as much as your unproveable personal beliefs. But do you even care what I think? I have been trying to understand your atheistic viewpoints, even if I can't intellectually respect them I am atleast trying to understand, seems to me you are not trying to understand my views at all, or rather you just don't want to...

[Codex]

ok then...please...give me YOUR concept/understanding of 'god' and your take on the entire universe and all existence   :sly:

If no one believed in god would 'god' still exist?

religion, with no followers it ceases to exist correct? so in saying so would the existence of a god cease to exist as well let alone have existed in the first place?

I went to a christian school, was forced to goto church when i was younger, now i follow no religion because of the retarded things we got taught in school about Christianity. I think that worshiping cats ended up making more sense to me then Christianity lol

[Retardobot]

If no one believed in god would 'god' still exist?

The concept of God would be abandoned but for that to happen, humans would have to let go of their fear of being out here all alone.

[psyche]

If no one believed in god would 'god' still exist?

I could believe a candy-covered mountain of money is going to materalize in front of my face, but it doesn't mean it's going to happen.

The concept of God would be abandoned but for that to happen, humans would have to let go of their fear of being out here all alone.

Wtf? I don't need to God or anything else to feel like i'm not alone. We're not alone anyway. What the hell are you people on? :sly:

even if the concept of God was abandoned (which is never going to happen, people desire a deeper knowledge of life that science can't offer us, it's human nature to be curious about the origins of our existence unless you are intellectually and emotionally stagnant) that doesn't make God cease to exist.

[Codex]

The concept of God would be abandoned but for that to happen, humans would have to let go of their fear of being out here all alone.

who needs god when you have a coconut named wilson

then no ones alone!

To be honest the only really big problem i have with people and religion is when they force religion onto their children or others eh

I could believe a candy-covered mountain of money is going to materalize in front of my face, but it doesn't mean it's going to happen.



Wtf? I don't need to God or anything else to feel like i'm not alone. We're not alone anyway. What the hell are you people on? :sly:

well obviously noting is going to materialize infront of your face but in gods existence there's no real way to mesaure a gods existence is there now

everyone is alone at some point in their lives in which RELIGION SAVES THE DAY BUDDY IT SAVES THE DAY HIGH FIVE
/sarcasm