Topic: Religion. The evolution, creation and everything in between megathread

Offline Apostrophe Spacemonkey

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Quote from: Xt1ncT


The extremeists want the US out of Iraq and so to recruit fighters from all over the world they put forward the idea that it's a religious war or Jihad.


Yes, they use religion as a tool to recruit fighter to their cause, they also use lying and brainwashing to recruit people to their cause.

Science is also used as a tool to make weapons for a war, swords, guns, gas chambers, nuclear weapons are all things made by science.

Religion is not a cause of a war, it's a tool used by a few to convince others to start a war, it's the leaders and kings which decide to go to war.


And think about it, if we didn't have science, the only fighting there would be is fist fighting and throwing stones.

Reply #825 Posted: February 05, 2007, 03:59:34 pm

Offline Xt1ncT

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Quote from: Spacemonkey
Religion is not a cause of a war, it's a tool used by a few to convince others to start a war, it's the leaders and kings which decide to go to war..
OMG - stop contradicting yourself.

The king/leader decides to go to war for whatever reason.

So to recruit he uses religion. So for the people he recruits, religion is the cause of the war.

You just said it yourself.

Take Islam out of the Middle East and voila, a hell of a lot of the problems that exist there are solved. Period.

OK, so once again that's a very simplistic argument, but valid nonetheless.

What about the Crusades? What was the cause there if not religion?

Northern Ireland? (IRA vs Protestant Loyalists)

Spain v England back in the day. (Catholics vs Church of England once more)

Mary Queen of Scots and all her trials and tribulations. (I'll give you a clue, she was Catholic and Elizabeth 1 was Church of England).

A common theme there don't you think?

Quote from: Spacemonkey

And think about it, if we didn't have science, the only fighting there would be is fist fighting and throwing stones.
Yeah just think about it - fists and stones and still wars over religion  :rnr:

Oh poor little Spacemonkey, he keeps contradicting himself, and because i point it out all he can do is resort to the whole negative rep thing...oh woe is me, I've been -rep'd by the monkey boy.

Reply #826 Posted: February 05, 2007, 04:06:19 pm

Offline Apostrophe Spacemonkey

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Quote from: Xt1ncT
Yeah just think about it - fists and stones and still wars over religion  :rnr:


Alot less people would die.

Quote from: Xt1ncT

The king/leader decides to go to war for whatever reason.

So to recruit he uses religion. So for the people he recruits, religion is the cause of the war.


No, the king/leader is the cause of the war.

If you take the king/leader away, the people would live according to their religion, and most religions tell people to live in peace.

Reply #827 Posted: February 05, 2007, 04:11:52 pm

Offline Xt1ncT

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Quote from: Spacemonkey
Alot less people would die.
Oh phew, that must be ok then.

Religion can start wars but without the religion to make powerful weapons less people die - that makes it all right does it? The answer is no. It doesn't.

Like I said before, I'm all for people using religion or faith to give them whatever support network etc that they need.

But enforcing those ideas on other people?? That's just not on. As for the wars that have started as a direct result from religious beliefs, well that just sucks and goes to show exactly what religion is responsible for.

Personally I don't think people HAVE to believe what I do - I'd like them to, but we live in a free
society so everyone is free to associate with whomever they want and believe whatever they want.

Reply #828 Posted: February 05, 2007, 04:17:09 pm

Offline Xt1ncT

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Quote from: Spacemonkey

No, the king/leader is the cause of the war.

If you take the king/leader away, the people would live according to their religion, and most religions tell people to live in peace.
Crap.

The neighbours with different religions would try to impose that religion on each other, and eventually what would it lead to?

I don't think I even need to answer that.

Reply #829 Posted: February 05, 2007, 04:19:36 pm

Offline Apostrophe Spacemonkey

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Quote from: Xt1ncT

The neighbours with different religions would try to impose that religion on each other, and eventually that would it lead to?


Not all religions tell people to impose their religion on others, only some do.

Yes, some religions are flawed and corrupted, but so are some governments.

The concept of religion is fine.

Reply #830 Posted: February 05, 2007, 04:24:47 pm

Offline Simon_NZ

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SM xt ownd you.

Iraq is religon, it is now a civil war between the shiate and the sunnis i think.

Reply #831 Posted: February 05, 2007, 04:30:56 pm

Offline BerG

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Dont worry Xtinct I'll give you some more power rep when possible.

Great entertainment in this thread btw.

Reply #832 Posted: February 05, 2007, 04:31:01 pm

Offline Apostrophe Spacemonkey

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Quote from: Simon_NZ


Iraq is religon, it is now a civil war between the shiate and the sunnis i think.


Thats a matter of opinion, not fact.

Some say it's about oil, some say it's about control, some say its about propaganda, others say its a big conspiracy and that it was a US who attacked themselves, and then others say its about religion.

People have come up with many different reason what they think the war is about, why are you so sure it is about religion? Why do you think you are right, and everyone else is wrong?

Reply #833 Posted: February 05, 2007, 04:40:48 pm

Offline Simon_NZ

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Intially it was about WMD or Oil whatever. But now it isn't.

The reason I think your wrong and I am right, is well I am.

E.G


(CBS) Behind the blood and chaos of the insurgents' bombs, there is an undeclared civil war already underway in Iraq, between the Sunni minority who ruled this country under Saddam and the Shiite majority.

They come from the main morgue that's overflowing, relatives too terrified to claim their dead because most are from Iraq's Sunni minority, murdered by Shiite death squads.


etc etc etc

Reply #834 Posted: February 05, 2007, 05:01:33 pm

Offline Black Heart

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Iraq is very complex. it was started out of kneejerk reaction to Sadams laughing at twin towers. WMD were the excuse to implement punishment. because revenge doesn't go down well as a reason for war.

that phase is over (well its not progressing). Now theres internal struggling for power and also outside forces intent on creating mayhem simply to cause the US to look worse to the entire international community.

Fact > Bush the US leader publicily claimed GOD had spoken to him and he was doing gods work.

ironically the US has muslim soldiers fighting in iraq.

I used to feel religion had a lot to do with wars, but WW2 was the bloodiest war ever, hitler was an aethiest (so was Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot) and the jews have been persecuted by lots of nations including england ~1600's so that doesn't really make it about religion. the jews are also considered a ethnic group, as well as religious group.

Reply #835 Posted: February 05, 2007, 05:09:24 pm

Offline Arnifix

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Quote from: Spacemonkey
Far many more people have died because of car accidents then wars over religion.

Bullshit.

Reply #836 Posted: February 05, 2007, 05:44:48 pm

Let us retract the foreskin of ignorance and apply the wirebrush of enlightenment.

Offline Hannibal4life

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Quote from: Black Heart
NO THEY DIDN'T!!!

without excavating they don't know what if anything was 'found'


STOP perpetuating LIES.

Nobody believed in a flat earth!!! 17th-18th century myth.

Noahs ark story theres has never ever been a global flood that has risen sea levels dozens of meters (hundreds if you beleive no land was above sea level) NEVER. its not even possible.



Dude its not lies they used carbon imaging my friend...

Reply #837 Posted: February 05, 2007, 06:46:18 pm

Offline Hannibal4life

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Quote from: Tiwaking!
Although this is mildly off topic: Uneducated peoples views of Jews in Israel is very skewed. All they see is the ultra-orthodox opinions, which do not reflect the opinions of the majority of Israelis. In fact, they could be considered both a minority but compared to their political weight(even though themselves are meant to be apolitical) they are a highly sought after political commodity due to their influence amongst the populace.

Before the creation of Israel there were quite a number of Jewish tribes and settlements who co-existed peacefully with their neightbours. Both the fledgling Palestinians and Jews both wanted the same thing: A homeland.

Zoom to 2006: One has a homeland and one doesnt. Being born in Palestine means you're a non-citizen, unrecognized by the world and possessing few to no rights. This can only be PARTIALLY blamed on Israel and alot of it is the World's fault(Britain, America and the U.N)


I suggest you read the WHOLE bible before taking parts of it and using it to bludgeon dissidents. If someone is ignorant of the bible(or any book considered holy for that matter) then directing them to it isnt going to affect anything.
"It is no use walking anywhere to preach unless our walking is our preaching" - Saint Francis of Assisi
"Preach the gospel and if necessary use words"

As for me: The unearthing of the Gospel according to Judas is of HUGE interest


My friend i have read the bible in fact i have begun a theology degree... and am currently working for scripture union, which is a strongly biblical organisation that has been around for a much longer time than most churches in nz, and has very strong links with anglican, baptist, presbyrterian, methodist, Apostolic, New Life, Catholic, Brethren, and many other Christian churches.

Reply #838 Posted: February 05, 2007, 06:51:31 pm

Offline Xt1ncT

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Quote from: Spacemonkey
Not all religions tell people to impose their religion on others, only some do.

Yes, some religions are flawed and corrupted, but so are some governments.

The concept of religion is fine.
Tell me one religion which doesn't. Just one.

Reply #839 Posted: February 05, 2007, 07:42:05 pm

Offline Xt1ncT

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Quote from: Spacemonkey
Thats a matter of opinion, not fact.

Some say it's about oil, some say it's about control, some say its about propaganda, others say its a big conspiracy and that it was a US who attacked themselves, and then others say its about religion.

People have come up with many different reason what they think the war is about, why are you so sure it is about religion? Why do you think you are right, and everyone else is wrong?
SM - you're only looking at it from the US's point of view.

Try taking those blinkers off and look at it from the Iraqi point of view - for them it is now all about religion.

They have got rid of the Baath party which was Saddam and the Sunni (a minority as it happens) and now the Shi'a are in charge.

All the bombings and kidnappings are now all about religion, nothing else.

Reply #840 Posted: February 05, 2007, 07:43:50 pm

Offline Arnifix

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Only one all-powerful entity died for my sins.

Reply #841 Posted: February 05, 2007, 08:35:59 pm

Let us retract the foreskin of ignorance and apply the wirebrush of enlightenment.

Offline Simon_NZ

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Reply #842 Posted: February 05, 2007, 08:36:57 pm

Offline Tiwaking!

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Quote from: Hannibal4life
My friend i have read the bible in fact i have begun a theology degree... and am currently working for scripture union, which is a strongly biblical organisation that has been around for a much longer time than most churches in nz, and has very strong links with anglican, baptist, presbyrterian, methodist, Apostolic, New Life, Catholic, Brethren, and many other Christian churches.

Oh good :D

When you finish your degree, could you please explain the details of the second convenant(I think its the second covenant) and what happened to Jesus's brothers and sisters.

Thanks!

Reply #843 Posted: February 06, 2007, 09:13:14 am
I am now banned from GetSome

Offline KiLL3r

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the bible condones incest?

adam and eves kids must of rooted each other into oblivion

Reply #844 Posted: February 06, 2007, 11:57:15 am


Offline KiLL3r

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Religion. The evolution, creation and everything in between megathread

Reply #845 Posted: February 06, 2007, 12:19:37 pm


Offline Hannibal4life

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Quote from: Tiwaking!
Oh good :D

When you finish your degree, could you please explain the details of the second convenant(I think its the second covenant) and what happened to Jesus's brothers and sisters.

Thanks!



By the second covenant ur referring to Jesus dying on the cross i presume??

As far as Jesus' brothers and sisters, the book of James in the bible was writen by one of his brothers... I don't think this really needs too much explaining. I guess i may as well explain the purpose of the bible then.. if you're open to finding that out then i will gladly explain it to you.

But only if you really do want to know because it takes a bit of explaining, and i need to ensure i have answered your question as wholely as possible.

Reply #846 Posted: February 06, 2007, 12:31:57 pm

Offline KiLL3r

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Quote from: Hannibal4life
By the second covenant ur referring to Jesus dying on the cross i presume??

As far as Jesus' brothers and sisters, the book of Jasmes in the bible was writen by one of his brothers... I don't think this really needs too much explaining. I guess i may as well explain the purpose of the bible then.. if you're open to finding that out then i will galdly explain it to you.

But only if you really do want to know because it takes a bit of explaining, and i need to ensure i have answered your question as wholely as possible.


please explain.

Reply #847 Posted: February 06, 2007, 12:35:19 pm


Offline BerG

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Haha, some little religious swine neg repped me for saying this thread was good entertainment.

I will now be negging every pro-religious person in this thread, unless they own up.

Reply #848 Posted: February 06, 2007, 01:21:16 pm

Offline ThaFleastyler

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I am pro-God, but I didn't neg rep you.
I probably can't because of the amount of pos rep I give you! :D

Reply #849 Posted: February 06, 2007, 02:17:37 pm