Call to jail parents who break video game age limits

[Bounty Hunter]

In a perfect world, I could agree with you. But in this flawed world where video games are the Evil Empire, this sort of shit needs to exist, soley to preserve my ability to purchase Japanese hardcore rape simulators. Or games like Manhunt.

ahaha, evil empire? you realise this is a gaming forum right? and that you play these games? sounds like someone has Stockholm Syndrome...

but you can't say "in a perfect world" that's like the biggest cop out ever man, it's like saying "if we could divide by 0"

games like manhunt are art, you think manhunt is fucked up? art has been fucked up for centuries...

[Arnifix]

ahaha, evil empire? you realise this is a gaming forum right? and that you play these games? sounds like someone has Stockholm Syndrome...

but you can't say "in a perfect world" that's like the biggest cop out ever man, it's like saying "if we could divide by 0"

games like manhunt are art, you think manhunt is fucked up? art has been fucked up for centuries...

Hmmm, so the options are I have Stockholm Syndrome, or you didn't understand what I said. Hmmm, haaa, pretty sure it's not the first.

[Bounty Hunter]

Hmmm, so the options are I have Stockholm Syndrome, or you didn't understand what I said. Hmmm, haaa, pretty sure it's not the first.

yeah I use stockholm syndrone somewhat loosely, you are a gamer who is sympathetic to game developers yet you label them evil.

as opposed to a hostage who is sympathetic to their captor who they may label evil.

all this because the internet is exactly the same as a hostage situation lol

[Arnifix]

yeah I use stockholm syndrone somewhat loosely, you are a gamer who is sympathetic to game developers yet you label them evil.

as opposed to a hostage who is sympathetic to their captor who they may label evil.

all this because the internet is exactly the same as a hostage situation lol

Ok, you need to be corrected.

The Evil Empire joke was refering to the fact that morons blame things like video games for societies inadequacy. These idiots are not going to stop bleating about how games that feature any adult content are evil and wicked, so I would prefer that they are pacified by a rating system that doesn't effect me, as opposed to banning "adult" games.

[UppityDuck]

These idiots are not going to stop bleating about how games that feature any adult content are evil and wicked, so I would prefer that they are pacified by a rating system that doesn't effect me, as opposed to banning "adult" games.

Shame they don't bleat about Rugby. That's got a whole lot more real world violence than any computer game!
....or cigarettes, alcohol, driving, drugs, not being able to assault their children, Harry Potter etc and cetera.

[darkFOX]

Wanna talk violence?

Ice hockey. There's gotta be a punchup every day.

[Bounty Hunter]

Ok, you need to be corrected.

The Evil Empire joke was refering to the fact that morons blame things like video games for societies inadequacy. These idiots are not going to stop bleating about how games that feature any adult content are evil and wicked, so I would prefer that they are pacified by a rating system that doesn't effect me, as opposed to banning "adult" games.

ohhhhhh....well that's fair enough...

[SlobŪ]

In a perfect world, I could agree with you. But in this flawed world where video games are the Evil Empire, this sort of shit needs to exist, soley to preserve my ability to purchase Japanese hardcore rape simulators. Or games like Manhunt.

QFT

Id generally agree too Bounty but we got to to step in somewhere, besides Chinese rape simulators are 22.5% less expensive than the Jap ones arnifix stated so Im all up with it.

[Dr Woomanchu]

Shame they don't bleat about Rugby. That's got a whole lot more real world violence than any computer game!
....or cigarettes, alcohol, driving, drugs, not being able to assault their children, Harry Potter etc and cetera.

I want to reply but I'm drinking bourbon and listening to Leonard Cohen so....

I have a suspicion that tomorrow i'll find i replied to a random post :/

[nick247]

a) what is your store policy and where do they draw the line.

Do they provide clear guidelines over when a store should and should not sell to a parent?

b) what is the actual law regarding retailers selling games to parents even if there is a suspicion that the parent will let their child play that game.

It sounds like the current law is a fucking mockery, almost a legal absurdity. You can exercise discretion as a parent in letting your child drink alcohol and watch r18 movies but you cannot let them ever play r18 videogames

c) We already accept limitations placed on our children viewing pornography and violence. It is not exactly unreasonable to extend this to video games where the participant has more control over what happens on screen. Watching violence versus creating violence.

So we cant deny that age limits on video games do play an important role in guiding our childrens development.

d) Is policing parents the best way to do this?

hell no, its a logistical nightmare coupled with an attack on parental discretion. It opens up a whole new set of problems.

[Zig]

This guy is if I recall correctly, a somewhat hardcore christian...you'd think someone in his position would have to be religilously neutral.

You can't choose somebody for a job (even this job) based on their religion...

He has obviously been chosen for his ability to make fair, impartial and logical decisions, and judging from what he has said in terms of the age restriction he seems to be doing his job.

Jail is a bit harsh (as Zara said), but the point he is getting at, which is that excessively violent games shouldn't be available to younger kids is correct.

I don't have a problem with your average FPS, as long as the kids playing are at least 14sh, but excessive violence (ie manhunt...) should definitely be restricted. How to enforce it? I don't think you can really, apart from (hate using cliches) educating parents.

[BeNZene]

Sensible Comments

Agree with your c & d. Not sure if I agree with point b (it is also a criminal offence to allow under 18s to watch R18 movies).

This dude reminds me of that Jack Thompson dude.

Jack Thompson: Self appointed attention seeking lawyer (now disbarred).

Bill Hastings: Government appointed chief censor (first by National, then by Labour), a lawyer with significant academic credentials.

This guy is if I recall correctly, a somewhat hardcore christian...you'd think someone in his position would have to be religilously neutral.

I've met him and I think its highly unlikely that he is a "hardcore" christian, and he has been regularly attacked by "hardcore" christians:

Apart from his professional role, some have taken issue with one aspect of his personal life in particular: Hastings is openly gay. Some of these critics include the Society for the Promotion of Community Standards; convicted paedophile Graham Capill, former Leader of the Christian Heritage Party; Brian Tamaki in the "Media: The New Witchcraft" section of a DVD produced by the Destiny Church for the 2005 general election; Peter Brown MP, Deputy Leader of the New Zealand First Party; and Pastor Ralph Ovadal's Pilgrims Covenant Church, a fundamentalist Christian church in Monroe, Wisconsin.

Why put ratings on games?

Protect childrenz? Bullshit
Educate populace? Bullshit

Make more money from games by setting up arbitrary guidelines and force publishers to either sign up or die? Exactly right

Could you explain your theory on this?  Who is making money out of the ratings scheme, and how?

[UppityDuck]

I want to reply but I'm drinking bourbon and listening to Leonard Cohen so....

I have a suspicion that tomorrow i'll find i replied to a random post :/

After that potent mix I hope you're still around tomorrow (today)!

[MercuryFree]

I've met him and I think its highly unlikely that he is a "hardcore" christian, and he has been regularly attacked by "hardcore" christians:

All good then, guess I was misled at some point

[Tiwaking!]

Could you explain your theory on this?  Who is making money out of the ratings scheme, and how?

Awww do I have to??

I've got an assignment due on Tuesday, can you wait til Friday?

Unless someone else wants to do it for me

[BeNZene]

Awww do I have to??

I've got an assignment due on Tuesday, can you wait til Friday?

Unless someone else wants to do it for me

It's probably easier to get an extension from me

[GhostOfGallipoli]

some angry 14 year old just neg repped lol



i still wont sell you GTA dude

[GhostOfGallipoli]

Awww do I have to??

no you dont, because you're wrong



no ratings = being able to sell the game to anyone, ie a much bigger market



having a game restricted restricts the market that can buy it


would've thought this obvious

[camy205]

for gods sake are we such pussys these days? i was seven when me and my mate got into half life back in the 90s, jeez.

[GhostOfGallipoli]

for gods sake are we suck pussys these days? i was seven when me and my mate got into half life back in the 90s, jeez.

is GTA IV suitable for a 10 year old?


yes

no

[Zig]

for gods sake are we such pussys these days? i was seven when me and my mate got into half life back in the 90s, jeez.

There is just a leetle difference between HL and GTA:IV...

[nick247]

for gods sake are we such pussys these days? i was seven when me and my mate got into half life back in the 90s, jeez.

You are 100% correct.

Video games do have an adverse effect on children

[Pyromanik]

Could you explain your theory on this?  Who is making money out of the ratings scheme, and how?

Government; see below.

Awww do I have to??

no you dont, because you're wrong
no ratings = being able to sell the game to anyone, ie a much bigger market
having a game restricted restricts the market that can buy it
would've thought this obvious

I disagree. Most kids will get a hold of the game anyway, the parents can just buy it with the child absent at the time. Same with alcohol.
The only place ratings are effective is in the movie theatre itself, where the child actually has to be present for obvious reasons... unless you're trying to smuggle one in in your backpack... o.0


And anyway...
He already did explain.
In post number four.
http://forums.iconzarena.com/showpost.php?p=899683&postcount=4

Well it all boils down to this:
Why put ratings on games?
Protect childrenz? Bullshit
Educate populace? Bullshit
Make more money from games by setting up arbitrary guidelines and force publishers to either sign up or die? Exactly right
It happened with movies and music and when games got lumped with it it happened again
Its like no one ever learns

The government charges to get games rated.
If a publisher wants to market their game inside the country, they first need to have it reviewed and rated. This costs money. Lots of money.
As opposed to the alternative; where pretty much the same amount of people buy the game, and that's it. The only 'extra' profit coming from here is the absense of the cost of getting the game reviewed and rated.






amirite tiwa?

[Zig]

I disagree. Most kids will get a hold of the game anyway, the parents can just buy it with the child absent at the time. Same with alcohol.
The only place ratings are effective is in the movie theatre itself, where the child actually has to be present for obvious reasons... unless you're trying to smuggle one in in your backpack... o.0

To some extent... I do see a lot of games being bought for children by their parents, but I can also think of several scenarios in my own childhood where me and my friends were prevented from playing games that were way too old for us because we weren't old enough..and our parents were too smart to buy them for us.

So the ratings do have some effect, how much is debatable.

[Tiwaking!]

The government charges to get games rated.
If a publisher wants to market their game inside the country, they first need to have it reviewed and rated. This costs money. Lots of money.

HUGE amounts of money. So much money that there has never been a transparent track of the amount of money spent on just rating a game.

As opposed to the alternative; where pretty much the same amount of people buy the game, and that's it. The only 'extra' profit coming from here is the absense of the cost of getting the game reviewed and rated.

In the realm of games ratings, NZ is a backwood little hick town. We just follow the crowd

Ultimately the ESRB(Entertainment Software Rating Board) control ALL game ratings

A quick trip over to their website(http://www.esrb.org/index-js.jsp) presents you with a short overview of the ESRB

The ESRB is a non-profit, self-regulatory body that independently assigns ratings, enforces advertising guidelines, and helps ensure responsible online privacy practices for the interactive online software industry

This sounds nice, concise and is full of lies

1) ESRB is non-profit: You pay them more, they'll rate your game lower. This is counter to the 'non-profit' ideology

2) ESRB is self-regulatory: No. Games Publishers are self-regulatory. The ESRB is the overlord, the absentee landlord, the presiders of the rotten boroughs. They are there to get a handout

3) INDEPENDENTLY ASSIGNS RATINGS: Once again, this ties into MONEY. Will the ESRB rate an EA game less harshly than one from Rando-Publisher house? Yes. Yes they will.

Also, the unstated LAW OF OUTRAGE AWESOMEOCITY

Shock sells. Outrage sells. NWA, Eminem, S.O.A.D(Minus Toxicity) all have the 'bad' label. Kids will snap that shit up. The minor fee you pay to the ESRB is nothing compared to the amount of capital you can generate by slapping the infamous "Parental Advisory" label on a game or album

edit: Some interesting links.

ESRB on the Defense - http://www.edge-online.com/news/esrb-defense

Court Terminates Schwarzenegger's violent videogame ban - http://www.3news.co.nz/Court-Terminates-Schwarzeneggers-violent-videogame-ban/tabid/209/articleID/92390/cat/310/Default.aspx?ArticleID=92390

ESRB: Utah Measure "Senseless" - http://www.edge-online.com/news/esrb-utah-measure-senseless
p.s I hate censorship