Bloody Students!

[Apostrophe Spacemonkey]

Repayments are increased by 2 cents, and they're out on the street protesting!

Get back to studying!

[Retardobot]

Not only that, but they've cut post-graduate student allowance.

After the government announced that to study as a Teacher you would have to enter post-graduate study.

Fucked all round.

[Zarkov]

Serves them right.

[Spigalau]

Do the math, once graduated, if they work 40 hours a week on minimum wage, the extra cost per day of repayments is less than 50c. It's such a hardship paying back money that you borrow that attracts nil fucking interest.

[Retardobot]

Paying back a loan regardless of interest, on minimum wage which is what a lot of students step into after becoming qualified, is difficult at best.

[Apostrophe Spacemonkey]

Fair enough.

But I bet most of those protesting students are still studing, and don't actually have to pay it back yet.

The ones who are paying it back are too busy working to waste time standing on a street protesting.


What is a bit silly, I think, is that they removed the voluntary repayment bonus. Which takes aways the only incentive to actually pay any more then the minimum amount.

[Retardobot]

Students are idiots in these parts.

Studying useless BA in Arts, getting hammered every night and costing the council thousands in clean up crews due to having to clean up broken glass every week.

I feel for those students who put in the hard yards and are more than likely the ones NOT at the protests because they understand that crying like a little bitch isn't going to change anything.

[Obble]

Please change thread title to 'Bloody Art Students' they are the problem. :3

[Kaizer]

Do the math, once graduated, if they work 40 hours a week on minimum wage, the extra cost per day of repayments is less than 50c. It's such a hardship paying back money that you borrow that attracts nil $#@!ing interest.

or leave NZ and never pay it back

Please change thread title to 'Bloody Art Students' they are the problem. :3

and Commerce students.

The goverment should instead give incentives to areas that need more students and remove incentives for areas that don't.

aka: If you go study Engineering/IT/Doctors/Nurses etc, then your loan is interest free. If you study Commerce/Law/Arts etc then your loan is not interest free.

This would get people studying and filling jobs in areas that actually need them, thus the Goverment getting their money back quicker, instead of this blanket increase in repayment rate.

As per usual though: This Goverment just takes the easy way out with everything and never finds real solutions to NZ's problems. This increase in repayment rate won't stop the culture of going to Uni to "live your dreams" and it won't stop graduated Commerce and Arts students getting in line for the Dole and competing against 200 other applicants for a job relating to their degree.

What is a bit silly, I think, is that they removed the voluntary repayment bonus. Which takes aways the only incentive to actually pay any more then the minimum amount.

Its perhaps because it wasn't very effective. I think students soon realised that they could make more in interest over the life of the loan just by leaving their cash in the bank instead of early repayments.

[kookynic]

Took me 5 years to study BDes Hons.

Now working 3 shit jobs paying back student loan of 60kish @ $29 per week. Half my wages go to Fuel so I can actually get to my fucking jobs. At this rate I'll be middleaged before its paid it off.

One of my classmates flew to Sydney 2 days after graduation last week, was instantly offered a job in Product Advertising @ AU$60k+ per year

I was invited to do my Masters, I guess thats out the window.

EDIT: I work 6.5 days a week :S

[Tandoori]

Can't say I have wanton disatisfaction with these areas of the budget, but I do feel that there is money that could be better spent on Education from other sectors - namely, Superannuation.

I do not support a capping of Student Allowance for Post-Graduate students, these people should be given as much support as possible. Instead, better management and auditing of the tax system and some principle changes to eligibility to student allowance could ensure that the recipients are those who need the money, rather than those whose parents have clever accountants (which sadly - albeit anecdotally - seem to be the majority of Student Allowance recipients ).

Who can blame them for protesting though? Voicing dissatisfaction with the government is an institution of student kiwi life. The issue of course, is whether or not all our graduates head overseas once they finish their degree because of a government who places more importance on looking after baby boomers than it does the economy.

[private_hell]

The goverment should instead give incentives to areas that need more students and remove incentives for areas that don't.

aka: If you go study Engineering/IT/Doctors/Nurses etc, then your loan is interest free. If you study Commerce/Law/Arts etc then your loan is not interest free.

This would get people studying and filling jobs in areas that actually need them, thus the Goverment getting their money back quicker, instead of this blanket increase in repayment rate.

the problem with this is that NCEA absolutely screws the students up in terms of pre-req's required for Engineering and IT - and i suspect its the same for medical degrees as well

[The Demon Lord]

just going to add in here - it took me 4 years (in total) working minimum wage jobs before I got my foot in the door of IT and was able to get a decent Salary and then to move from the position I was in to the company I am at now - I had to do a fair amount of personal education in my own time to bring my skills up to the point where I could ask for the higher salary

That was with no tertiary education.

if you come out of uni with a degree - you still have to do the 3-4 years of hard grind in crappy bottom rung jobs before you have the experiance necessary to start commanding a decent pay packet. Also it helps if you do stuff in your own time and claim it as experiance - maybe you have finished a graphic design course, well do some freebies or mates rates jobs for friends/family business and put it on your CV.

Work experiance people.

[BerG]

I currently pay $79/week to student loan.

How much will I now have to pay following this budget?

That is all.

[Tandoori]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/budget-2012/6985706/English-taunts-student-protesters

Looks like he's more or less hit the nail on the head.

I know it's more to do with VSM, but there are times when I am thankful that Douglas got that through because of things like this:

NZUSA President, Pete Hodkinson said students felt "targeted" by the Budget.

"What is not fair and reasonable, and what this government doesn't want to accept is that the loan repayment threshold kicks in below the poverty line for our graduates who shouldn't be forced into paying for the 'private benefit of education', before that benefit is realised," Hodkinson said.

The NZUSA consistently breaches its mandate by making statements on political issues that do not fairly represent the members of the associations that it is made up from. The cost of VSM is that we will never have a national student association that can say it speaks for all students - but I'd rather have no voice than a voice that pushes an agenda on my behalf that I didn't agree to.

[Spigalau]

I currently pay $79/week to student loan.

How much will I now have to pay following this budget?

That is all.

Another $16 a week. ie 20% increase from 10c in the dollar to 12c.

[BerG]

That's quite painful actually.

[Retardobot]

just going to add in here - it took me 4 years (in total) working minimum wage jobs before I got my foot in the door of IT and was able to get a decent Salary and then to move from the position I was in to the company I am at now - I had to do a fair amount of personal education in my own time to bring my skills up to the point where I could ask for the higher salary

That was with no tertiary education.

if you come out of uni with a degree - you still have to do the 3-4 years of hard grind in crappy bottom rung jobs before you have the experiance necessary to start commanding a decent pay packet. Also it helps if you do stuff in your own time and claim it as experiance - maybe you have finished a graphic design course, well do some freebies or mates rates jobs for friends/family business and put it on your CV.

Work experiance people.

Industries work differently from each other. IT is probably one of the few industries that will allow it's inhabitants to climb the ranks on experience alone. I don't think the financial sector would want many people working in it if they weren't accredited, same goes for the medical industries. Some sectors just have too much theoretical practice involved that force you to go through tertiary education. Early Childhood Teaching requires tertiary education to become an accredited teacher, and now it will require post-grad study which is now no longer covered by the SL scheme.

Also, if you plan to work internationally, having an international qualification is going to mean a fuck load more than experience with a few places that have no bearing on an international stage.

Experience doesn't always = more money. Certain areas within industries have capped salaries.

[Tandoori]

Early Childhood Teaching requires tertiary education to become an accredited teacher, and now it will require post-grad study which is now no longer covered by the SL scheme.

Wait what? I thought the limit to post-grad study was only on Student Allowance? They're not offering loans either?

[mattnz]

I think inmotion may be wrong there. I don't think they're changing the 10-year limit on loans. So you can keep on studying, you just need to borrow living costs.

[Retardobot]

Sorry, I was referring to SA. Don't know why I put in SL.

My bad.

[Retardobot]

Sorry, I was referring to SA. Don't know why I put in SL.

My bad.

[The Demon Lord]

Industries work differently from each other. IT is probably one of the few industries that will allow it's inhabitants to climb the ranks on experience alone. I don't think the financial sector would want many people working in it if they weren't accredited, same goes for the medical industries. Some sectors just have too much theoretical practice involved that force you to go through tertiary education. Early Childhood Teaching requires tertiary education to become an accredited teacher, and now it will require post-grad study which is now no longer covered by the SL scheme.

Also, if you plan to work internationally, having an international qualification is going to mean a fuck load more than experience with a few places that have no bearing on an international stage.

Experience doesn't always = more money. Certain areas within industries have capped salaries.

I think you missed the wood for the Tree - certainly in the finance sector you need accreditation, but just being accredited alone is not going to land you a sweet job raking in a 60K + Income, thats where you need the experiance.

Same with being a Lawyer, a good friend of mine who passed is bar exam, spent 2-3 years as a clerk before finallying becoming a full fledged lawyer - again gaining expierance at a lower rung.

my point is that students who complain about there not being any jobs or jobs that don't pay well tend to forget that while they have a nice qualification, their lack of experiance means they are going to do some hard graft for a few years before being able to get those nice fat salaries

[Zarkov]

Took me 5 years to study BDes Hons.

Now working 3 shit jobs paying back student loan of 60kish @ $29 per week. Half my wages go to Fuel so I can actually get to my fucking jobs. At this rate I'll be middleaged before its paid it off.

One of my classmates flew to Sydney 2 days after graduation last week, was instantly offered a job in Product Advertising @ AU$60k+ per year

I was invited to do my Masters, I guess thats out the window.

EDIT: I work 6.5 days a week :S

$29.00 dollars a week is around $1500 pa.

It'll take 40+ years at that rate.

What's your definition of middle age?

[Tandoori]

I think you missed the wood for the Tree - certainly in the finance sector you need accreditation, but just being accredited alone is not going to land you a sweet job raking in a 60K + Income, thats where you need the experiance.

Same with being a Lawyer, a good friend of mine who passed is bar exam, spent 2-3 years as a clerk before finallying becoming a full fledged lawyer - again gaining expierance at a lower rung.

my point is that students who complain about there not being any jobs or jobs that don't pay well tend to forget that while they have a nice qualification, their lack of experiance means they are going to do some hard graft for a few years before being able to get those nice fat salaries

Indeed - that is of course, if you're from the middle/lower class.
In this incestuous little country it's not hard to get a backhander or a job if you're in the right social circles - I'm sure that is more or less the tendering process for all the lucrative government contracts.